Disciples of the Mysterium

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Before I met my husband, I'd never fallen in love, though I'd stepped in it a few times. ~ Rita Rudner

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[Francis]

In that case, allow me to recommend a good whine.

[Jana]

While he is biased toward critique everyone of his criticisms are correct in my estimation...it is a very nice tidy package of disclosure. He is certainly not whining...he is using tactical precision missiles to blow apart the facade of Das Man—the Borg. It is not like you haven't heard it before, it is just that he puts it all in one place and with such eloquence.
As I finish up the article I will see if he leaves us any room to stand or if we should call it a dud game.
Awesome MT...hope he has given up the reptilian thing.

[jimtzu]

i'm looking at this piece thru the lens of Tsarions use of the word Mysterium..  given the different definitions that are in the piece it all comes down to man's personal and cultural ego and how it has distorted man's view and place in the world with a layer of illusion on top of something that is already whole.  or more precisely, cutting up and dividing reality to fit what the ego believes is needed to survive (and conquer).
"In fact, depending upon which tradition a person comes from, the great Mysterium can be defined as god, spirit, essence, higher consciousness, nirvana, purpose or life meaning, physical excellence, intellectual supremacy, global peace, utopia, and so on."
what that means to me is that  god, spirit, consciousness, meaning, philosophy, psychology, integral etc...  are all just mental constructs that are used as a protective barrier between the ego and the real (natural) world.  his incorporation of the Tao is crucial because it's the simplest attempt (Occam's razor) of man's expression of his place in the world. language, symbols and thoughts are all steps away into the illusion of the mind (mysterium).  but man's ego keeps wanting to delve deeper into this illusion and language is all we (had to use it) have, so endless articles, philosophys, religions are written and concieved of to try to explain it all, even this article....  and on and on it goes...

these quotes will explain his take on "oneness"
"This is because there is no such thing as Oneness. Oneness is an abstraction. It exists as an idea in man's mind, but not in reality."
"If Oneness is an illusionary idea, then identity and individuality as we think of them are also illusions."
"The oneness experienced by the Taoist and Man of Dasein, is not the same as that of the theologian or New Age smiling depressive. His is not the oneness of a million broken shards brought together in a heap. On the contrary,  his oneness is allness and  wholeness. It is made from complete things seen and received in their whole state.  This idea makes greater sense once we contemplate the manner in which we have misconstrued the meaning of the terms “one” and “oneness.”
The existentially awakened man sees oneness as allness not because he is a monist, but because he is aware of how division, duality, and diversity came about."

[Jana]

Yes I think he was pointing to the misguided "need" for a mental construct, an abstract made up idea of the numinous...it is a difficult point to get. Because it takes Jacobs ladder, it takes the climb of abstraction to get beyond the mind to direct communion...and then the ladder is thrown away and there is nothing much to talk about it anymore. MT is offering a classic sword fight on our attempts to fabricate holiness in order to cover up our separation. The ego's plan to get spiritual.

The same mind that fabricates a  "need" for a mental construct of God can be used to dismantle that need and discover a prior union (Oneness)...that is what MT was attempting I think.

 

[Nickeson]

Hey,

Wandering around in Mr. Tsarion's essay, playing. I've worked enough this week, now is a time to play.

The following quote is a pretty good paragraph, though my compulsive inner editor-child likes to play too and wonders, "...and what does truth have to do with anything?"

Ultimately, the Taoist is the Tao. He is himself Existence and Truth. Although this may sound heretical, it is nonetheless true. How long, we wonder, will it take for a man >people< to understand that there is no enlightenment outside himself >themselves<. How much time will pass before man >and realize< once and for all that there is no spiritual illumination or social perfection awaiting him in the future >them<? (Note to MT: "awaiting" obviously implies a future. There is no need for redundancy unless one purposely wants to read like a hack.)

The following quote is not such a good paragraph because it rests on a totally speculative assumption that could be just as mythical as the fall of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.

"The thinking of all men is traumatized and autistic, not the thinking of one or two men. All mankind suffered the shell-shock and fallout of the age of catastrophe. Otherwise, the derangement we find in the human mind would not be widespread."

The best that can be said for that and most of what follows through the next couple of sections is that it is marginally entertaining.

For example: the following is worth a chuckle:

Mr. Tsarion writes

" Reality is Triality

    "The Tao gives birth to One (My emphasis.). One gives birth to Two. Two gives birth to Three. Three gives birth to all things – Lao Tzu (Tao Te Ching)"

Then a few sentences later:

"This is because there is no such thing as Oneness. Oneness is an abstraction. It exists as an idea in man's mind, but not in reality. "

But didn't the Tao just give birth to One?

And then there is the two or three paragraphs where he tried to imply that Taoists were wandering sannyasins..."However, such a Being cannot and will not live his life in an environment constructed and inhabited by unsane men transfixed by false ideas about Existence"...when it is clear that Taoists were some of the most influential people in the social and political heart of ancient China.

And then there is the take on numerology which is part of his anti-one agenda, he writes:

"One - birth, beginnings, self, god
Two - division, duality, separation, opposites
Three - creativity, growth, pregnancy, abundance
Four - structure, order, discipline, practicality
Five - experience, learning, understanding, expansion, man/woman
Six - sexuality, harmony, unification
Seven - subjectivity, self-analysis, introversion, religion
Eight - achievement, success, extroversion, conquest
Nine - mastery, refinement, precision, humanity, ending"

These are moderately accurate summarizations of the supposed qualities of numbers, with the exception of Five, which is mostly about change and transition, and One, which most numerologists would say is about individuality, autonomy and (Tah Dah)...sovereignty...the major pitfall to which is Belief, especially in the words of anyone who possesses less intelligence, wisdom, experience, intellectual honesty and fewer communicative skills than one knows oneself to have.

Having reached this point, I have to take stock. This is getting to be work. Each paragraph comes with plaintiff squeak, "Critique me, critique me!"

Its not going to happen. It is a Sunday afternoon and it just might rain.

But I will say in closing that at the end Mr. Tsarion appeared to be following in the footsteps of L. Ron Hubbard. First one literalizes and universalizes the mythological Fall of Humanity, preferably these days in a pseudo-scientific manner. Then one creates the equivalent of The Devil. And then one envisions the redeemed state. And then one almost modestly demurs from the cry of the (hopefully) fawning minions: "He is our redeemer!" and starts accepting their tithes. Remember what L. Ron once told a friend (more or less), "The fastest way to become a millionaire is to create a heaven and start selling maps on how to get there."

[Francis]

"If Oneness is an illusionary idea, then identity and individuality as we think of them are also illusions."
"The oneness experienced by the Taoist and Man of Dasein, is not the same as that of the theologian or New Age smiling depressive. His is not the oneness of a million broken shards brought together in a heap. On the contrary,  his oneness is allness and  wholeness. It is made from complete things seen and received in their whole state.  This idea makes greater sense once we contemplate the manner in which we have misconstrued the meaning of the terms “one” and “oneness.”

But oneness is not an illusion. It's the only thing that isn't, and that's what makes it unique. It's so hard to name because it is so utterly unique. The million broken shards dissolve as if they were never there because they were just a mirage in the first place, projected onto a unified field. The only thing left is the oneness because that's all that was ever there anyway. If you never saw the shards then you would never appreciate the oneness.   

We shall not cease from exploration. And the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time ~T. S. Eliot

I mean, sure, the concept and the term 'oneness' are both abstractions, as are all words and concepts. But the referent is more real than ever, in the case of oneness. I'm not falling for this guy's shell game. Good call Steven.

[Jana]

Yes, but the new age Oneness is fake. Its a token Oneness. I remember a woman came into the store and she had been to Nick Arjuna's Oneness thing and was part of his troop. When I made out that I would have liked to have seen Nick in Denver she stuck her nose up and intimated that I wasn't good enough to join her Oneness click. So as with all metaphysical concepts they are only relevant within the particular incestuous tribe.

Obviously there is the One, and the Many and the Nothing.

We give token gesture to Oneness to ease the pain of our separation and isolation, but as long as society is hostile to personhood we can never be connected to cosmos enough to join in unity with others.

[Francis]

 She intimated that you were not worthy of 'oneness'? Or that you were not welcome in her car pool? or both?

Maybe she drives a prius. Shouldn't everyone come in the same car for a 'oneness conference'?
 

[Jana]

No, I am saying that Oneness is very conditional...nothing about car pooling.
I doubt I have ever met anyone with a genuine Oneness realization....if I did they would probably be stoned.

[Lawrence]

No, I am saying that Oneness is very conditional...nothing about car pooling.
I doubt I have ever met anyone with a genuine Oneness realization....if I did they would probably be stoned.

... 'Stoned,' as in 'high as a kite,' or 'Stoned,' as in 'rocks, pebbles and boulders' kinda stoned?...

[jimtzu]

Obviously there is the One, and the Many and the Nothing.

and to take that further... they're all the same, depending on one's (hehe) perspective, much like the wave/particle situation in quantum physics....which brings up the notion of the observer.... hmmmm

[Jana]

Good point Lawrence...hot rocks and stoned. Say kundalini bliss and nude sunbathing and hot rocks that is what bought me to inner conjunction one time. But you are not actually there in unity consciousness...you are gone...but paradoxically more there.
So this ties into the One, Many and Nothing being the same thing. Of course there are no words to describe how these are not even a change in perspective. It is more like simultaneous layers. Integral consciousness may be a type of field awareness.